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View Full Version : sac river *green* sturgeon



GoT HeeeeM
02-27-2008, 10:59 PM
headed out today around 1230 PM to the sac river with my friend ted...had ghost and pile as bait...launched at the interesting clarkesburgh launch ramp :-? current was rippin and water was chocolate brown!!! anchored up at our first spot and nothing for an hour and a half...moved to our second spot and after 45 min or so we both just didnt like where we were at....sooo, we make our final stop just down the river from where we were fishing but this time a little closer to the bank...after about 30 min or so i got a mean take down and line starts screamin on my clicker....kicked it in gear and ripped his lipps....FISH ON! fought him for about 25 min from hookset to hooks being popped out...couldn't believe that it turned out to be a green sturgeon?? didn't know they got this big as i've only seen people catchin smaller ones here and there..which by the way, how common are they????my biggest previous sturgeon was 63' and this one was well longer and way fatter!! we came prepared this time though and brought the camera, and got some pretty cool footage...there is some cussing, enjoy ;D ;D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ls0Ie252NwE

GN.
02-27-2008, 11:07 PM
Congrats on the green. It's still fun to catch em even if you don't get to keep em.

crowbar1
02-27-2008, 11:17 PM
Nice!!!!!!!

crazyted
02-28-2008, 12:25 AM
U LIKIE THE BOAT O''FRANSUA

FishinRaiders
02-28-2008, 01:29 AM
Great video guys. You both had me busting up the whole time

I caught his runt little brother last year a couple miles from where you guys where

swikmo
02-28-2008, 08:49 AM
SICK AS !*%! !!!!!!

Nice going guys and great report! Looking forward to more of them in the future and hitting this area up more often once things get rolling which is looking to be sooner than later.Tight lines!

Swik

GoT HeeeeM
02-28-2008, 11:13 AM
U LIKIE THE BOAT O''FRANSUA


haha, my french sidekick....anyone have any idea of how common a big green sturgeon is?? i'm wondering :-/ :-/ i was really suprised to see it not be a white sturgeon

GreatWhiteHunter
02-28-2008, 04:18 PM
Cool Vid! 8-)

fishrecon
02-28-2008, 04:40 PM
haha, my french sidekick....anyone have any idea of how common a big green sturgeon is?? i'm wondering :-/ :-/ i was really suprised to see it not be a white sturgeon

The largest recorded Green Sturgeon was taken out of the Klamath River and was over 8 feet long. Mature females can grow to about 6 feet in length, anything over that is considered rare. As with white sturgeon, females are larger than males, and I don't think males can grow larger than 6 feet.

The largest ones have been estimated from 40 to 70 years old. Of course, there is a lot less known/certainty about aging and growth rates of Green Sturgeon as compared to White Sturgeon.

-Congrats on the fish, can't wait to check out the vid when I get home.

fishrecon
02-28-2008, 04:46 PM
Sorry about my previous post, I though you we're asking how big can they get? I'm not sure anyone knows how common they are. They're considered threatened so, that right there should tell you not too common.

fishrecon
02-28-2008, 04:50 PM
I just did a little more digging. The data is really old (1954-1987), but DFG once reported a ratio of 1 to 78 for adult green sturgeon to adult white sturgeon.

GoT HeeeeM
02-28-2008, 06:03 PM
I just did a little more digging. *The data is really old (1954-1987), but DFG once reported a ratio of 1 to 78 for adult green sturgeon to adult white sturgeon.

i just rarely ever heard of people catchin them and was curious...appreciate the info 8-)

dimpala95
02-28-2008, 06:29 PM
Cool video but next time zoom out a little so you're not just looking at empty water. It'll make your video more interesting.

What bait were you guys using?

GoT HeeeeM
02-28-2008, 06:50 PM
Cool video but next time zoom out a little so you're not just looking at empty water. It'll make your video more interesting.

What bait were you guys using?

yea i know, we both thought the same thing...all i can say is the next one, which will be real soon, will be much improved...

i thought i put the bait choice at the the top of the report?? pile and ghost

Newty
02-28-2008, 07:56 PM
Nice video! Good job on the greeny.

NorKalkiller
02-29-2008, 09:25 AM
i think there pretty much an endangerd species very few numbers i think it was just less than a year ago they lost 5 or 6 posibley more big breaders over 6 ft under the shasta dam i think it was

RENOBOYS
02-29-2008, 09:44 AM
That is a nice "MEAN GREEN"!!!! I have yet to hook one yet. I don't have any problem releasing them, that goes for any game fish. We only keep what we can eat. I am not into stocking the freezer w/ fish that may get eaten someday

fishrecon
02-29-2008, 10:08 AM
i think there pretty much an endangerd species very few numbers i think it was just less than a year ago they lost 5 or 6 posibley more big breaders over 6 ft under the shasta dam i think it was

Here is the article your referring to:

Sturgeon crushed by dam gates
By Matt Weiser - Bee Staff Writer

Last Updated 12:52 am PDT Monday, June 25, 2007
Story appeared in METRO section, Page B1

Print | E-Mail | Comments (6) | Digg it | del.icio.us

Ten rare adult green sturgeon were recently squashed by the gates of the Red Bluff Diversion Dam on the Sacramento River, marking what one official called a "very unfortunate" setback for another dwindling river species.

The sturgeon, all spawning adults, are believed to have been trapped by the dam's gates before May 24, with the most recent carcass being discovered June 10. The dam is operated by the U.S. Bureau of Reclamation.

Jeff McCracken, a spokesman for the bureau, said the fish probably died after being caught in the dam's partially opened gates. When the gates were later closed, the fish were crushed or cut into pieces.

While sturgeon are the largest threatened fish in the Sacramento River, the species' loss comes amid a related crisis for the river's tiniest fish, the fingerling Delta smelt, also threatened. Both are imperiled by water diversion systems.

"If we want to have any native fish populations left, it's time to take a sober look at what we use water for in California and assess what are reasonable uses and what aren't," said Jeff Miller, conservation advocate at the Center for Biological Diversity.

The National Marine Fisheries Service last year listed Sacramento River green sturgeon as threatened under the Endangered Species Act. That resulted from a petition filed by Miller's group and two others.

Last year, the state Department of Fish and Game estimated there may be as few as 50 spawning-age green sturgeon in the river, so the 10 dead fish could represent 20 percent of the population.

All the dead fish were spawning adults, said Maria Rea, manager of the Sacramento office of the National Marine Fisheries Service. They ranged from 48 to 82 inches long. At least two were female and four were male.

Sturgeon are known to become more prolific spawners as they age, so mature fish are considered especially valuable.

"These were large, old fish, which makes this a significant and very unfortunate event," Rea said. "We think this could constitute a significant portion of the spawning population."

Rea said there is no sign the deaths resulted from wrongdoing. As an interim measure, her agency ordered that when gates at the dam are opened, they must be open at least 12 inches so sturgeon can pass without being trapped.

The dam, built in 1964, is a long, low structure that diverts water from the Sacramento River near Red Bluff into the Tehama-Colusa Canal. The canal provides water to farmers on the west side of the Sacramento Valley.

McCracken said the timing of dam operations was unusual this year because of the dry winter and requirements to accommodate migrating spring-run Chinook salmon. This may have contributed to the deaths of the sturgeon, which also must migrate past the dam to spawn upstream.

He said only one sturgeon has been killed by the gates before, in 2002.

"It's just really weird why all of a sudden there seems to be a plethora," he said. "We've never seen this before in all the years that we've operated that dam."

Green sturgeon are one of the oldest known fishes in North America, believed to date back 200 million years. Like salmon, they spawn in freshwater but spend a large part of their lives in the salty waters of San Francisco Bay and the ocean. They do not reach spawning age until at least 13 years old, then they spawn every two to five years and often live to be 70 years old.

The state Department of Fish and Game recently banned anglers from keeping green sturgeon and imposed new catch limits on its even larger cousin, the white sturgeon. Both are threatened by poaching, water diversions, competition from non-native species and water contamination.

fishrecon
02-29-2008, 10:18 AM
I'm not saying the sturgeon crushed weren't green sturgeon. But, I'd sure like to know who identified them, and how qualified they were. White sturgeon tend to get an olive/brownish tinge to them after they've been in the river awhile. I wouldn't put it past a biologist to misidentify them. Heck, I've seen others misidentify fish out in the field before.

I just find it pretty disturbing that this story wasn't brought out into the light more. DFG reported as low as 50 spawning adults in the river and somebody called it "very unfortunate." That's damn near "catastrophic" to wipe out 20% of a spawning population.

GoT HeeeeM
02-29-2008, 10:18 AM
thats crazy! poor sturgies *:( after we popped the hooks she was still all juiced up, swam away by herself instantly

RENOBOYS
02-29-2008, 12:00 PM
Good man EB--

I beleive that the poachers, snaggers, etc post the biggest threat. Hell they don't even care what size, color, how many. Who knows how many of the Greens that have been taken by them before or after the new regulations

EastBayAngler
02-29-2008, 01:49 PM
Nice job guys...Too cool 8-)

Marty Gingras
02-29-2008, 02:35 PM
...I'm not saying the sturgeon crushed weren't green sturgeon. *But, I'd sure like to know who identified them, and how qualified they were...

Hi all,

The fish killed at the Red Bluff Diversion dam were green sturgeon and were identified by several sturgeon biologists.

This was a big deal because the green sturgeon are listed under the federal ESA and the RBDD is a federal facility.

RBDD changed operations to avoid the circumstance that we think lead to the death of the green sturgeon.

Thanks

Marty Gingras
Supervising Biologist (Fisheries)
California Department of Fish and Game
Bay Delta Region
4001 North Wilson Way
Stockton, California 95205

Phone (209) 948-3702
FAX (209) 946-6355
email mgingras@dfg.ca.gov

Marty Gingras
02-29-2008, 02:37 PM
...
I beleive that the poachers, snaggers, etc post the biggest threat...
Hi all,

I have heard many times that green sturgeon taste like dirt and their eggs make bad caviar. No kidding. Spread the word.

Thanks

Marty Gingras
Supervising Biologist (Fisheries)
California Department of Fish and Game
Bay Delta Region
4001 North Wilson Way
Stockton, California 95205

Phone (209) 948-3702
FAX (209) 946-6355
email mgingras@dfg.ca.gov

fishrecon
02-29-2008, 02:43 PM
Thanks Marty. Didn't mean to call anyone out. I didn't see any reports from the feds on this issue. It is nice to get some answers.

Are there any studies going on to estimate the spawning population of Green Sturgeon this year? The paper quoted DFG stating "there may be as little as 50 spawning adults" in the river. They didn't mention the upper end of the estimate or the confidence level associated with it.

RENOBOYS
02-29-2008, 02:45 PM
Thank you Marty. Any "real info" is muchly appreciated. Have you had a chance to read the posts today regarding the poaching taking place in the Delta. There have been several reports of people having the "balls" to take an oversize sturgeon to the bait shop to be weighed. Do you have any "pull" to get a warden to look into this matter??

thanks,
RenoBoys

Marty Gingras
02-29-2008, 03:00 PM
...Are there any studies going on to estimate the spawning population of Green Sturgeon this year? *The paper quoted DFG stating "there may be as little as 50 spawning adults" in the river. *They didn't mention the upper end of the estimate or the confidence level associated with it...


...There have been several reports of people having the "balls" to take an oversize sturgeon to the bait shop to be weighed. Do you have any "pull" to get a warden to look into this matter...

Hi all,

We really appreciate your conservation ethnic and the opportunity to give you guys information.

There are a couple of studies that look at --- or have real potential to look at --- the number of spawning greens in the Sacramento. One is about genetics and the other is a mark-recapture calculation conducted as an offshoot of a telemetry study about green sturgeon habitat use.

The one that we've referenced is a genetics study by UC Davis. They look at baby green sturgeon and do complicated statistical analyses that figure out how many parents contributed to the population of babies. I don't know enough about the statistics to know what the biases are, but it's being peer-reviewed. As I recall, during the last 5 or so years there have never been more than about 200 spawning pairs and once around 20 pairs. Don't quote me. Happily, their estimates are about the same magnitude as our estimates based on white sturgeon abundance and the white:green ratio.

I will send an email message to the Assistant Chief of Enforcement telling him what you've posted here about poaching. They are VERY eager to nail poachers of sturgeon in general and those who sell meat and roe from sport-caught or poached sturgeon.

Thanks

Marty Gingras
Supervising Biologist (Fisheries)
California Department of Fish and Game
Bay Delta Region
4001 North Wilson Way
Stockton, California 95205

Phone (209) 948-3702
FAX (209) 946-6355
email mgingras@dfg.ca.gov

RENOBOYS
02-29-2008, 03:03 PM
Thanks Marty-- We appreciate all the info. Nail those poachers.

fishrecon
02-29-2008, 03:50 PM
Thanks Marty,

It's nice to know they aren't being overlooked.

I wonder how many green sturgeon migrate up the river, but don't end up spawning? Seems a little odd for 10 spawning adults to make it all the way to RBDD before finding a suitable place to spawn lower in the river. It also seems noteworthy that you would have ten green sturgeon in such close proximity in the absence of any white sturgeon. Maybe there are some significant differences in spawning habitat use. If they need access upstream of RBDD, that could be another argument to keep the dam gates up for a couple more months and force new alternatives to divert water at RBDD.

crazyted
02-29-2008, 04:04 PM
we could tell he was a green from a good distance.

I would find it hard to confuse one with a white.

Marty Gingras
02-29-2008, 04:07 PM
...Seems a little odd for 10 spawning adults to make it all the way to RBDD before finding a suitable place to spawn lower in the river. *It also seems noteworthy that you would have ten green sturgeon in such close proximity in the absence of any white sturgeon...

Right you are! *Green sturgeon seem to over-summer up there and are known to over-summer pretty far up in at least one other river system. They certainly tend to spawn farther upstream than whites tend to and in some rather salmon-like habitat. *The UC Davis folks say the green sturgeon eggs have characteristics that mean they do better in clearer waters with bigger sediment. *

It's looking a bit like the RBDD area and higher is pretty much 'green sturgeon habitat', but we are looking at a number of different sources of data and information to learn more.

I've spoken with a couple of Guides from up there and at some point I'll talk with more. *If anyone here has a lot of experience up there or ideas about who to talk to, please fill me in.

Thanks

Marty Gingras *
Supervising Biologist (Fisheries) *
California Department of Fish and Game *
Bay Delta Region *
4001 North Wilson Way *
Stockton, California *95205 *
*
Phone (209) 948-3702 *
FAX * * (209) 946-6355 *
email * mgingras@dfg.ca.gov

*Deltadog*
03-03-2008, 07:47 AM
Nice job on a very rare fish!! But dang son...turn off that clicker!! ;D
Dog

*Deltadog*
03-03-2008, 07:50 AM
I'm not saying the sturgeon crushed weren't green sturgeon. *But, I'd sure like to know who identified them, and how qualified they were. *

Its very easy to distinguish a green or gold from a white...
Dog

GoT HeeeeM
03-03-2008, 09:16 PM
Nice job on a very rare fish!! But dang son...turn off that clicker!! ;D
* Dog

that would be boring... :P

B-RAN
03-03-2008, 10:13 PM
man that gives me hope that i can go out and catch sturgeon in my 12 footer ;D

*Deltadog*
03-04-2008, 07:53 AM
Nice job on a very rare fish!! But dang son...turn off that clicker!! ;D
* Dog

that would be boring... :P
Just a pointer..the clicker on your reel is to give you an audible signal when a fish has taken your bait in freespool. Reeling and casting with the clicker engaged may cause damage to your reel, and cause it to slip or wear out prematurely.

GoT HeeeeM
03-04-2008, 10:41 AM
Nice job on a very rare fish!! But dang son...turn off that clicker!! ;D
* Dog

that would be boring... :P
Just a pointer..the clicker on your reel is to give you an audible signal when a fish has taken your bait in freespool. Reeling and casting with the clicker engaged may cause damage to your reel, and cause it to slip or wear out prematurely.

lol...really? reeling and casting with the clicker engaged "MAY" cause damage to your reel? hmm, well i've never casted my reel with the clicker on, and as far as reeling with it....it was for the audience of the video so they could get a perception of how strong the fish actually was ..like i said, it would have been boring IMO without the clicker on...you should share your tips with the hundreds of other people on youtube.com who do the same thing ;D

striper_assasin
03-04-2008, 11:55 AM
gotta admit, besides the clicker being on the whole time, the next most annoying thing would have to be listening to the little bells all day long from peoples rod tips while they reel in to rebait or are casting or fighting a fish, them things are like nails on a chalk board for me.
sorry i didnt call ya back saturday night delta, i ended up stuck out at the limelight downtown getting hammered with some friends.wish i could have went out though, they were hittin em pretty good at the slough.

*Deltadog*
03-04-2008, 04:21 PM
gotta admit, besides the clicker being on the whole time, the next most annoying thing would have to be listening to the little bells all day long from peoples rod tips while they reel in to rebait or are casting or fighting a fish, them things are like nails on a chalk board for me.
sorry i didnt call ya back saturday night delta, i ended up stuck out at the limelight downtown getting hammered with some friends.wish i could have went out though, they were hittin em pretty good at the slough.
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

*Deltadog*
03-04-2008, 04:22 PM
Nice job on a very rare fish!! But dang son...turn off that clicker!! ;D
* Dog

that would be boring... :P
Just a pointer..the clicker on your reel is to give you an audible signal when a fish has taken your bait in freespool. Reeling and casting with the clicker engaged may cause damage to your reel, and cause it to slip or wear out prematurely.

lol...really? reeling and casting with the clicker engaged "MAY" cause damage to your reel? hmm, well i've never casted my reel with the clicker on, and as far as reeling with it....it was for the audience of the video so they could get a perception of how strong the fish actually was ..like i said, it would have been boring IMO without the clicker on...you should share your tips with the hundreds of other people on youtube.com who do the same thing *;D
::) ::) ::)

Craig
03-04-2008, 04:23 PM
Looked like a lot of fun!! Great job....I really enjoyed the video.

Jeremiah_Claar
03-04-2008, 06:01 PM
Awesome fish, i myself have never landed or seen a greenie that big. I did manage last year to catch 3 small greenies in the napa river. Strange lookin, with very sharp and pronounced scutes. I guess maybe they are making a come back. I never caught any before last year and the fact i caught some small ones tells me they are spawning and that gives me a small glimmer of hope for the future.