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SlayinRainbows
12-11-2011, 07:10 PM
Hey guys,
I am new to this site and wanted to ask some questions and get a little feedback from some experienced people. Quick background story: I live in Temple City, CA. right next to Pasadena, and this area is NOT know for it's fishing. The areas around me are not anything to brag about, Santa Fe Dam, Azusa Canyon, Puddingstone Reservoir and Peck Lake. If I want to drive another little bit you can hit some good ones like DVL, Corona, Santa Ana and Big Bear. My current financial situation forbids me to get a boat......but I LOOOOOVE to fish, so shore fishing is where I'm at. I've been fishing since I was a little kid but never often enough to get good at it. Now it's the only hobby I can really enjoy (and afford).
I realize that the answer to most, if not all, of these questions will be, "Try different things and see what works." cause it always is. A few basic good ground rules and advice is all I'm looking for. I have a 6'6 light and 6'6 medium light, but that's only cause I haven't bought my Phenix 7' ultra light yet, so they're holding me over 'till then. I'm using 4lb XXX line. What I've been doing is rigging both rods up with gang hooks, one at 12" and 36"- the other 24" and 48". I have both those in the water usually with floating salmon eggs, mice tails, dough and whatever else. I dip them all in the trout garlic or corn dip and have a different bait on each hook. I figured that'd be a good way to find out what they're biting. I've been using a water filled bobber (full) instead of a 1/4 or 1/2 oz egg weight above the swivel and was wondering if either one had an advantage over the other, (not counting the bobber being able to float with less water). Would the difference between the 1/4 and the 1/2 be that much more noticeable to the fish? I've been using size 14 trebles but I don't feel like I'm hiding the hook as well as I should so I was thinking of switching to 16 treble. How is a size 10 or 12 mosquito hook for those salmon eggs and mice tails? When I'm not fishing deeper I'll fill a bobber 1/2 way with a 36" or longer leader and float it for a while or cast and drag. I try out a few different baits on that.
I probably check the bait about every 15 min then cast it back out. If another 15 min go by I'll reel it in and switch em up. After about an 1 1/2 - 2 hrs I'll relocate. ONE LAST THING I PROMISE!!! When it comes to lure and fly colors....I am curious to learn what colors are supposed to be better at morning, afternoon and night as well as clear, stained and dark water.
I apologize for the small novel I just wrote, but I really appreciate any time you guys may have to let me know what I'm doing wrong or anything else......other than try different things and see what works cause I'm already doing that. THANKS!

- Rocco

CRABBY
12-11-2011, 07:24 PM
Well Rocco I see ya made it,good man,hopefully some of our bank pro's will post up,hopefully the stuff they use up here will work for ya down there,also you might to ck.out the last weeks threads an posts on what's being used,just go to trout board(HERE) an read up a little an you'll get to see some members at work,good an bad,LOL.....Don

SlayinRainbows
12-11-2011, 07:40 PM
Can't wait!

CRABBY
12-11-2011, 08:08 PM
Can't wait!LOL,well we'll see sometimes they get lockjaw or finger cramps or something ya never know....Don

Old_School
12-11-2011, 08:26 PM
Heres an old school technique. Trebles are ok but not necessary. Sometimes too heavy and sink your bait. I always liked size 12-14 single egg hooks ( short shank) on a 4 lb leader. 6 max. either way make sure your bait floats by quickly testing it in the water before u cast out. May try a single hook set up instead of multiple hooks, varying the leader till you find the optimum length. Leader length often depends on the height of vegetation to get it just above that. 3 ft was usually my starting point. Water bobbers can work, but if u got two rods, rig one up with a 1/4-3/8 sliding sinker above a small swivel, and leader snapped to the swivel. Cast out and let it quickly sink. When it hits the bottom reel in just enough to tighten line and put in holder or prop up. U may need to tighten line a little here and there. Dont drag across bottom. Take a very small bobber clipped to a v small snap swivel. Leave the snap side of the swivel open and use to hang on you line, 2 line guides from the tip of your pole. It will hang on your line and pull the line down from your pole. Reel in till the bobber hangs 6 inches from your pole consistently. This can be hard in the wind. This is your bite indicator. When a fish bites, the line will tighten and the bobber will go up. When the bobber goes up hard enough to launch off the line you have a good one! Good luck!

TroutGhost
12-11-2011, 08:59 PM
Find out when the trout plants happen
The California DFG plants Rainbow Trout in the Santa Fe Dam, Puddington, and Peck Lake. Here is the planting schedule (http://www.dfg.ca.gov/fish/hatcheries/fishplanting/southcoast.asp) for that area noting what week they will be planting.

Find out where the fishing hot spots are
Talk to the concessionaires at those lakes to find out where the fishing hot spots are as well as where the plants happen. Some times the planters will be hanging out in that general area, swimming in circles, often close to shore. If you have a two rod permit then you may want to toss one of your offerings somewhat close to shore and another one a bit further away.

Points are often good areas to fish.

Powerbait dough
Cal Kellog did a good video on how to catch trout with powerbait dough (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLJ3YGmFt6Y). Experiment with how much leader you need.

Slip sinker rig
There's a pic in this discussion illustrating the slip rig (http://www.fishsniffer.com/trout-board/66368-what-am-i-doing-wrong-fishing-101-a-3.html) method way of fishing powerbait dough, berkely power worm or mice tails.

Probably a good idea to use a four pound leader. Might have to use a bead between the swivel and the weight to keep it from slipping through to the hook.

Powerbait mice tails and worms
If you're fishing mice tails or power worms, make sure to use a small hook, like around a size 12. Test it at home in a salad bowl or other container filled with water to make sure the worm embedded with the hook floats. Be sure to buy a Worm Threader, it makes it easier to thread a hook through a worm. Have the hook poke out about a half inch behind the mice tail head (or a half inch from the big end of the worm) and the leader line can poke out about half way down the 3 inch worm (1.5 inches). That will help it wiggle wacky-fashion in the water. People say to rig it with an 18 inch to two foot leader. I've been doing fine with about three feet. Test or look around what locals are using successfully and how long the leaders are.

Reconnaissance
Walking around a lake and hanging out watching what others are using is a good way to prepare yourself. Check out how long those leaders are on the rigs that are catching. Take note of where they are tossing their lures. Not just where the successful fisherman are fishing from, but where they are tossing to, the exact spots they are pulling fish out of. Sometimes that can make a difference.

Give back!
Remember to return here and post pics and an account of what works for you. ;)

Good luck!

Captain Compassion
12-11-2011, 09:28 PM
Grew up in Monterey Park and graduated Mark Keppel HS so I gotta help a home boy.

Simplify. You are fishing for stocked trout put into the waters by the DFG or some private hatchery if you are going for bonus trout. All them smelly things are good for pulling monster Macks from 200 feet of frigid water or coxing cannibalistic browns to hit a lure. The stockers don't know what those smells mean. Forget the fancy baits. Get yourself a jar of Gulp dough in chartreuse or red. Rig it up like Old School sez. Very few stocker bows of any size can resist this. I use #16 or #18 trebles and appily only enough bait to float the hook. Lures should be gold such as Kastmasters, Panther Martins or Super Dupers. Flies should be dark. Try brown or olive woolly buggers or small plastics below a bobber that are about the size of a trout chow pellet. Keep in touch and let us know how you do.

CC

SuckerPunch
12-12-2011, 08:36 AM
This thread (http://www.fishsniffer.com/trout-board/93722-black-cloud-%40-amador.html) has info that should help you.

Agree with Captain Compassion - keep it simple. Hatchery trout, which are in all the LA Basin waters down there, are not smart. As far as trebles, I wouldn't use anything bigger than an 18 for trout - though really hard to find, I prefer size 20. Also, whether you use lead or a water-filled float to get your bait down depends on what the fish are doing, which is determined, in part, by water temperature. Right now, the water should be cool enough for trout to be on the surface, so, if that's the case, bombing out bait with a bunch of lead to fish deep is going to get you nothing - stay with the water-filled float, which'll fish the water column on its descent.

Of course, none of the above is worth anything if you don't know something about the fish. If you're after hatchery fish, you should always look for (1) where they plant (usually at the launch ramp, like Castaic) and (2) the nearest corner to the planting location. Anything that forces those fish to turn concentrates 'em. For instance, that little cove just to the right of the Castaic ramp, and the corner of the dam just to the left, would always hold trout.

As far as lure colors go, it depends on what you're tryng to do. With hatchery trout, you just want 'em to know it's there, so going with maximum contrast and visibility is important. If the sun's not on the water or there's lots of chop, chartreuse and silver are hard colors to beat. If the sun's on the water and it's calm, black and gold both give good contrast. If you're after holdover fish, which are abundant in all the San Bernardino Mountains lakes, you have to go with more natural-lookin' stuff. Small marabou jigs in olive green fished along weedlines up at Big Bear during winter was off the hook for full-finned, larger 'bows.

Captain Compassion
12-12-2011, 09:00 AM
Find out when the trout plants happen
The California DFG plants Rainbow Trout in the Santa Fe Dam, Puddington, and Peck Lake. Here is the planting schedule (http://www.dfg.ca.gov/fish/hatcheries/fishplanting/southcoast.asp) for that area noting what week they will be planting.

I grew up fishing at Legg Lake. On the weekends and during the summer our folks would drop by brother and I off there in the morning and pick us up in the afternoon. It was free to fish there in the late 50s and early 60s. Not sure about now. The DFG still stocks the place and it isn't far from where you live. Caught lots of trout there. The popular bait back then was Velveeta Cheese.

CC

SlayinRainbows
12-12-2011, 11:55 AM
You guys are all awesome! I definetly need to down size my trebles and I'm going to try the other suggestions as well. We're gettin hammered with rain out here right now, but as soon as it lets up I'll head out and report back.

finsane
12-12-2011, 09:26 PM
Cant add much to the advice you already have as far as bait fishing and rigging, everyone else covered that very well. The only thing I might add is on colors of lures, I usually try to match conditions, darker or stained water I'll use darker lures [copper brass, oranges etc.], clearer water I'll go with chromes, chartreuse and so on. As far as flies go, try to notice some of the ones around the lake and especially the ones hatching on the surface and go with a pattern that imitates that. Good luck.....Finsane.:signfishon34hi6zv:

Theb55
12-13-2011, 08:10 AM
We would be dead meat up here in Canada with hooks rigged like that. Definite no no.

TroutGhost
12-13-2011, 09:41 AM
Thanks for the info... I'll keep that in mind next time I'm reaping fish in Canada.

Just to keep this discussion on topic, this discussion is about planted trout in specific lakes located in Southern California. ;)

Old_School
12-13-2011, 12:33 PM
Treb55 may bring up a good point...When he says "definite no no" is he refering to Slayinrainbows comment about putting multiple hooks on one leader?

I am not sure, but something is telling me this is not allowed for trout fishing.
I know is it common in saltwater applications. The more hooks the better right!, but in freshwater for trout I'm not sure. Although lures commonly have multiple hookes.


Slayinrainbows, you better ck the regs on this one.

Old School

Marv
12-13-2011, 02:28 PM
Just stick to Troutghost and SuckerPuch's advise. Thay are pretty smart, no need to complicate things while you're learning. Good luck and have fun!

TroutGhost
12-13-2011, 07:52 PM
>>>refering to Slayinrainbows comment about putting multiple hooks on one leader?

Old_School , if that's the case then it's a misunderstanding. Re-read the original post. Two fishing rods (legal if you have a two rod license) and each line with two hooks:



one at 12" and 36"- the other 24" and 48".

That's one pole with two hooks (hook located at 12 inches and another at 36". And a second pole with two hooks, hooks located on the line at 24" and 48". That's similar to a Cheese & Egg Spreader Rig. Totally legal in California. Southbend makes those, they're available everywhere.

>>>Thay are pretty smart

Thanks for the compliment but I'm still learning. Just sharing what I know so far. :P

SlayinRainbows
12-13-2011, 08:35 PM
Thanks for the clarification TroutGhost! There must have been a misunderstanding somewhere cause I have a two pole license and use just 2 hooks on each pole. Anyways, I hit up Santa Fe Dam last night in the rain for about 2 hours with no luck. I went again today, probably spent three hours or so in the afternoon there and was able to land one right before I had to leave. So far most of my catches have been off of a full water bobber with about a 12" leader and a treble hook loaded with Gulp floating salmon eggs. I need to pick up some smaller treble hooks cause I think the 14's I'm using are making it more difficult to hide the hook properly. I use the smaller bobber when I'm fishing right off the shore but I use the bigger one when I want to launch it out there, though I'm worried the larger bobber may be to noticeable to the fish. As far as the bobbers go, is there a general rule of thumb, no matter what size they are, when they're full they sink and when they're half full they float? I tried using an egg weight above the swivel cause I thought it would be smaller and less noticeable, all my luck has been on sinking those bobbers. Any more advice on how to use those bobbers more effectively?
There is a little stream up at Azusa Canyon and fly lining crickets first thing in the morning almost GUARANTEE'S several catches, but shore fishing at lakes is new world to me. I gotta say you guys have been really cool, thanks again.

P.S. Sorry guys I can't upload the pic I took of the bobbers cause the file was to large.

Marv
12-13-2011, 08:46 PM
DON'T HIDE THE HOOK IN THE EGG! Go to youtube and learn "how to tie a simple hair rig" wich is a loop hanging from the hook shank. Tie a hair rig on a Gamakatsu #8 single egg hook. The whole hook is exposed this way and even if the fish tries spit, a bare Gamakatsu is sticky sharp. Only hide the hook when using powerbait or other kinds of dough.

Marv
12-13-2011, 08:56 PM
Also try using a longer leader on the water bobber 18"-36". Lipripperz, trout power worms, wooly buggers, Berkley atomic tubes, and night crawlers all work good on the water bobbers as well. As far as size use the smallest you can get away with.

SlayinRainbows
12-13-2011, 10:10 PM
Do you float all those the same way you would float powerbait or eggs?

Marv
12-13-2011, 11:03 PM
No, you slowly reel them in. I didn't mean to jump the gun, on the other lures yet but those are water bobber lures. For your powerbait and eggs a slip sinker rig is your best bet.

Rig your poles like trout ghost mentioned. You can figure out what depth to set your leaders also what color they are keyed into. Also you can toss a lure while you soak your powerbait. Buy 1 lure, yeah 1 for starters and chuck that sucker.

What lure, pick one of these: 1/8oz. gold kastmaster, 1/12oz. gold Mepp's Agila, 1/8oz. blue/chrome Lil Phoebe, 1/8oz. rainbow trout Thomas bouyant, #1 or #2 gold blade w/yellow body w/red dots Panther martin in-line spinner. Cast,reel,repeat.

SuckerPunch
12-14-2011, 05:16 AM
Thanks for the clarification TroutGhost! There must have been a misunderstanding somewhere cause I have a two pole license and use just 2 hooks on each pole. Anyways, I hit up Santa Fe Dam last night in the rain for about 2 hours with no luck. I went again today, probably spent three hours or so in the afternoon there and was able to land one right before I had to leave. So far most of my catches have been off of a full water bobber with about a 12" leader and a treble hook loaded with Gulp floating salmon eggs. I need to pick up some smaller treble hooks cause I think the 14's I'm using are making it more difficult to hide the hook properly. I use the smaller bobber when I'm fishing right off the shore but I use the bigger one when I want to launch it out there, though I'm worried the larger bobber may be to noticeable to the fish. As far as the bobbers go, is there a general rule of thumb, no matter what size they are, when they're full they sink and when they're half full they float? I tried using an egg weight above the swivel cause I thought it would be smaller and less noticeable, all my luck has been on sinking those bobbers. Any more advice on how to use those bobbers more effectively?
There is a little stream up at Azusa Canyon and fly lining crickets first thing in the morning almost GUARANTEE'S several catches, but shore fishing at lakes is new world to me. I gotta say you guys have been really cool, thanks again.

P.S. Sorry guys I can't upload the pic I took of the bobbers cause the file was to large.

Generally, if your bubble is full of water, it'll sink, although the oval cheapies you get at Wally World will often develop cracks where the fat end of the insert meets the body of the bubble. This'll let air in and cause the bubble to float. Also, those oval bubbles could use some quality control - often the fat end of the insert is just barely bigger than the hole in the bubble body, in which case, after a few uses, the fat end of the insert just goes straight through the bubble's body, making it useless. Adjust-a-Bubbles are better built, but they have a much higher density than the oval bubbles when full of water, and consequently they sink too fast for 'em to do a really good job of fishing the surface or water column. Additionally, there are two tabs in the base of the Adjust-a-Bubble that need to be cut or filed off - if not, your line will catch on 'em and tangle. Still, they are nice floats for a range of aplications and species. As far as the oval bubbles go, there was a company that made more expensive ones that tended to be better than the Wally World cheapies - I can't remember the name of the company, but I think they came in a blue package with three floats and bead and stops for fishing 'em as slip-floats.

A 12-inch leader seems way too short to me - I usually have leaders ranging in the 4- to 6-foot range. Also, what size line are you using? Bigger line is okay to use in turbid water, but a 2-lbs leader line, thin though it may be, will always get bit.

If throwing metal, GO SLOW - one of the biggest mistakes I've seen trout guys throwing metal do is reeling 'em in too fast. You want to go just fast enough to get that spinner blade turning or that spoon body thumping - doing so will give you maximum flash and vibration.

Finally, being that you've only gotten bit with the bubble, it sounds like the trout you're after are pretty much on the surface - stick with the bubble. As far as sizes, I've always used the smallest one you can buy - when full of water, if I remember correctly, they're about 3/16 oz, which is more than enough weight to bomb it out as far as you want on ultralight gear.

Jfitalia
12-14-2011, 09:50 AM
Thanks for the clarification TroutGhost! There must have been a misunderstanding somewhere cause I have a two pole license and use just 2 hooks on each pole. Anyways, I hit up Santa Fe Dam last night in the rain for about 2 hours with no luck. I went again today, probably spent three hours or so in the afternoon there and was able to land one right before I had to leave. So far most of my catches have been off of a full water bobber with about a 12" leader and a treble hook loaded with Gulp floating salmon eggs. I need to pick up some smaller treble hooks cause I think the 14's I'm using are making it more difficult to hide the hook properly. I use the smaller bobber when I'm fishing right off the shore but I use the bigger one when I want to launch it out there, though I'm worried the larger bobber may be to noticeable to the fish. As far as the bobbers go, is there a general rule of thumb, no matter what size they are, when they're full they sink and when they're half full they float? I tried using an egg weight above the swivel cause I thought it would be smaller and less noticeable, all my luck has been on sinking those bobbers. Any more advice on how to use those bobbers more effectively?
There is a little stream up at Azusa Canyon and fly lining crickets first thing in the morning almost GUARANTEE'S several catches, but shore fishing at lakes is new world to me. I gotta say you guys have been really cool, thanks again.

P.S. Sorry guys I can't upload the pic I took of the bobbers cause the file was to large.







Glad to see your getting bit!! However stick with what your doing but get rid of that dam treble!!! for one its hard to make your bait float and its a pain to load up with bait. Keep things simple and forget about the "hair rig" there is no reason to use it. Just use a single Owner Mosquito hook in a size 8-10 and load that up with bait. The hooks are sharp as hell and will give you more options to fish with. That way if they arent hitting the eggs and you want to try a crawler you can or even a power worm. You'll get far better hook ups on the Mosquito hook than you will a treble. If your adament on using a treble for some reason then you need to drop to size 16-18 but again with a treble or "hair rig" you are limiting your options

Marv
12-14-2011, 11:45 AM
f your adament on using a than you will a treble. If your adament on using a treble for some reason then you need to drop to size 16-18 but again with a treble or "hair rig" you are limiting your options


I'll rig some stuff up on a hair rig. All the baits mentioned work great on a "hair rig".

Marv
12-14-2011, 12:51 PM
All baits work on a hair rig. Here are a couple examples.


Power egg's
8009

Powerbait mouse tails
8010

Crawler/masrhmellow combo
8011

Cheese
8012

Powerbait
8013

Real salmon egg's akso work great as well. Hope this helps!

SlayinRainbows
12-14-2011, 03:31 PM
Ok great! I'm almost done guys, bear with me for one more minute. I'm a little confused, to cast and drag with the bobbers on the surface, I should fill the bobber half way, leave a sufficient leader (36" or so) and use the previous mentioned bait like a lure?

CRABBY
12-14-2011, 03:49 PM
Rocco,forget the treble hook........:thumbsup:........Don

SlayinRainbows
12-14-2011, 03:59 PM
Got it. Stickin to mosquito hooks.

Marv
12-14-2011, 04:38 PM
Fill the bobber approximately half full of water. Cast the bobber. Give a little flick on the rod to locate the rig. This will also straighten out the leader to prevent knots.

Retrieve the rig slowly If you see a fish rise, cast past the rise and retrieve the rig through the rise ring in the water. The trout will strike quick and hard. They think they are crushing an insect in their jaws. Set the hook! You must keep the tension on the fish or he will spit the hook.

If the trout are not rising, completely fill the bobber with water. When you cast it out, it will sink slowly. Try counting to 5. The longer you count before retrieving, the deeper the bait/lure will run. You will need to play with the depth until you find the fish.

SlayinRainbows
12-14-2011, 05:43 PM
Well gentlemen, I do believe that about sums it up for me. Thank all of you for the great advice! I'm going to Corona or Santa Ana lake this Sat. I'll be sure to report back!

Jfitalia
12-14-2011, 06:14 PM
Well gentlemen, I do believe that about sums it up for me. Thank all of you for the great advice! I'm going to Corona or Santa Ana lake this Sat. I'll be sure to report back!



Oh dude those are my lakes! I got some tips for those lakes. You need to dump the bobber idea. just use one rod with egg sinker and pb, the other with a,small shot 18inch leader with a,power worm our Judy a plain trout jig

CRABBY
12-14-2011, 07:15 PM
Oh dude those are my lakes! I got some tips for those lakes. You need to dump the bobber idea. just use one rod with egg sinker and pb, the other with a,small shot 18inch leader with a,power worm our Judy a plain trout jigJ now your gonna get him mixed up,whens the last time you fished those lakes??......:oregonian_winesmile....Don

Jfitalia
12-14-2011, 11:22 PM
J now your gonna get him mixed up,whens the last time you fished those lakes??......:oregonian_winesmile....Don


Every winter for 15yrs! my did lived down there until 2 years ago but I still have family there. Both those lakes are great because the have "pro staffers" that go around the lake and give tips to those anglers struggling.