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  1. #16
    Member Roughster's Avatar
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    Re: Flounder

    Well I stand corrected! I emailed both the Marine and Warden DFG Q&A's with links to two different sources one saying it was legal and the other saying it was illegal, and got the following answer:

    Hello,

    The post you linked from Pier Fishing In California is copied directly from an official DFW Q and A, just as you asked. The information found in that post is correct.



    Here's a link to the actual Q and A: California Outdoors Q and A | Ask CDFW about hunting, fishing and wildlife conservation | Page 7


    Scroll down to the post from April 18, 2013, and you will see the same information that was posted on Pierfishing.


    Bottom line: When there is an ocean closure for starry flounder, there would be a corresponding zero limit in freshwater as well.
    SO, my apologizes to those who were correct on this issue! The good news is that we have the answer right here in this moment, the bad news is that until directly addressed my guess is the answer from field Wardens may vary from time to time. I personally have experienced a positive read from warden in the field saying it was legal to retain.

    I would strongly encourage DFG to make this regulation an explicit statement due to abundance of Starry flounder catches East of the Carquinez. As mentioned before, if you are striper fishing West of Powerlines and East of Carquinez, you almost have to try and not catch these guys during the Winter / early Spring. Given the ambiguity in the Regs, you are putting Legal-minded fisherman at risk of doing the wrong thing because of poorly written regs. That just creates resentment in the fishing public and re-enforces the idea that regs are written in a manner that are not setting the public up for understanding of the actual requirements, but rather setting them up for enforcement actions.

    Great conversation guys! I always try to be legal 100% of the time, and I was "edumacated" on something new today!

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  3. #15
    Senior Member ApexPredator's Avatar
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    Re: Flounder

    I decided to do some research on this topic to help clarify the issue. If you do not want to read my whole post here is the answer... Starry flounder may be taken from shore or spear at any time, for boat anglers only Jun1-Dec31. The math is below.

    If you look at the freshwater fishing regulations under section 5.45 Marine fin fish, mollusks and crustaceans: “Marine fin fish, mollusks and crustaceans taken in lagoons and tidal waters are subject to the bag and possession limits established for the Ocean and San Francisco Bay District (beginning with section 27.00). See the Ocean Sport Fishing Regulations booklet.”

    In the Ocean SPR booklet, the state is broken up into 5 different sections (Northern, Mendocino, San Francisco, Central, Southern). Just about all of the areas we would find flounder in brackish/fresh water fall under the San Francisco section.

    In the Ocean SPR booklet for San Francisco in section 27.35 reads:

    “SAN FRANCISCO GROUNDFISH MANAGEMENT AREA.
    This Section applies to take and
    possession of all 90 species of federally-managed groundfish, California sheephead, ocean whitefish, and all greenlings of the genus Hexagrammos in the San Francisco Groundfish Management Area. Federal groundfish include, but are not limited to, rockfish, cabezon, lingcod, California scorpionfish, kelp greenling, and some species of sharks, skates and flatfish. For specific definitions, applicability, and procedures, see sections 1.91 and 27.20. For size limits, possession limits, and other regulation that apply to individual species, see specific sections beginning with Section 27.60.
    (a) The San Francisco Groundfish Management Area means ocean waters between 38°57.50’
    N. lat. (at Point Arena, Mendocino County) and 37°11’ N. lat. (at Pigeon Point, San Mateo County).
    (b) Seasons, depth constraints, and special closure areas (except as provided in (c) below):
    (1) January 1 through May 31: Closed.
    (2)June 1 through December 31: Open for all species only in waters shoreward of lines
    approximating the 30-fathom depth contour, defined by connecting the set of 30-fathom way
    points adopted in Federal regulations (50 CFR Part 660, Subpart G)…
    …(3)…
    .
    .
    (c) Special exceptions to sub-section (b) above:
    (1) “Other Flatfish” as defined in sub-section 1.91(a)(10), which include Pacific sanddabs,
    may be taken or possessed in all depths year-round. “

    So if we follow section 27.35 3, C, 1 to 1.91(a)(10) it reads:

    Other federal groundfish section 28.49/ time period and depth limit are “same as RCG Complex, above” which reads:
    Time Period:
    Boat-based anglers Open: Jun 1-Dec31 Closed Jan 1-May 31
    Divers, Shore-based anglers: Open year-round
    Depth Limit: 180’ or 30fm

    Starry flounder are noted by name in the bag limit section of “Other federal groundfish” and not “Other flatfish” so they are not a part of the 27.35, 3 (c) 1 "other flatfish" exception.

  4. #14
    Senior Member XPL051v3's Avatar
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    Re: Flounder

    Maybe we can have Marty here confirm for us. I'll be out in the delta Monday and would like to know just incase.

    -Xzi


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

  5. #13
    Senior Member Swimbaitjunkie's Avatar
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    Re: Flounder

    Let's cut to the chase....If I were to catch a flounder I would keep it.....

  6. #12
    Member Roughster's Avatar
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    Flounder

    Just compared 2012, 2013, and 2014 regs. Nothing has changed between those years regarding this issue. 2014 states again that the Carquinez Bride is the boundary between salt and RGC vs Inland Waters. Feel free to read them yourself.

    I am curious on what grounds you think I am wrong on.


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  7. #11
    Senior Member Swimbaitjunkie's Avatar
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    Re: Flounder

    Quote Originally Posted by BigUnInDaBoat View Post
    On boats? Shore is OK.
    I talk to several boaters that had caught flounders N kept them, but the majority of them were caught by bank fishermans fishing for stripers....

  8. #10
    Senior Member BigUnInDaBoat's Avatar
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    Re: Flounder

    Quote Originally Posted by Roughster View Post
    I was told by DFG that above the Carquinez they are legal to keep, below they fall under Rockfish Regs and are only open during RFG.

    Here is a link that confirms:
    NorCal Fishing News: Starry flounder regulations explained

    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    That was written in 2012, do you trust it? Maybe I'm reading the regulations wrong, but I believe you may be incorrect.

  9. #9
    Senior Member BigUnInDaBoat's Avatar
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    Re: Flounder

    Quote Originally Posted by Swimbaitjunkie View Post
    I see folks keep starry flounder all the time around Sherman Island to Rio Vista.....
    On boats? Shore is OK.

  10. #8
    Member Roughster's Avatar
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    Flounder

    I was told by DFG that above the Carquinez they are legal to keep, below they fall under Rockfish Regs and are only open during RFG.

    Here is a link that confirms:
    http://www.norcalfishingnews.com/sto...plained?id=541

    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Last edited by Roughster; 02-20-2014 at 08:13 PM.

  11. #7
    Senior Member Swimbaitjunkie's Avatar
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    Re: Flounder

    I see folks keep starry flounder all the time around Sherman Island to Rio Vista.....

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