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sokoo
07-08-2005, 07:03 PM
I have decided to buy a new Gregor MX 780 boat, after asking a lot of questions here. Thanks to all of you who gave me valuable advice.

Visited a dealer today, and came up with a price that is not too diffficult to accept. The boat, trailer and 40HP Honda, plus fuel tank and battery for $14600. But when he gave me the final cost, I was surprised to see a dealer preparation and freight fee of $1400.

Is this amount within the normal range of preparation fee when you buy a new boat? Seem to me this is ridiculous, but I have 0 experience buy a boat from dealer before. Can someone educate me what amount should I expect for this preparation fee? Thanks a lot.

northriver_tom
07-08-2005, 07:09 PM
sounds way high...northriver wanted 250.00 for mine and after b.s. for 1/2 an hour we came up at zero..the only dealer prepartion i saw on my boat was..they washed it...to make a long story short dont pay it..

SturgeonVirgin
07-08-2005, 07:16 PM
I have decided to buy a new Gregor MX 780 boat, after asking a lot of questions here. *Thanks to all of you who gave me valuable advice.

Visited a dealer today, and came up with a price that is not too diffficult to accept. *The boat, trailer and 40HP Honda, plus fuel tank and battery for $14600. *But when he gave me the final cost, I was surprised to see a dealer preparation and freight fee of $1400. *

Is this amount within the normal range of preparation fee when you buy a new boat? Seem to me this is ridiculous, but I have 0 experience buy a boat from dealer before. Can someone educate me what amount should I expect for this preparation fee? *Thanks a lot.


I agree with NRTom, the y are going to get plenty of profit on that boat without the "prep" fee. Ask nice, if they still want to charge you for it, tell them its a deal breaker. I tend to think nearly 15K for a setup like that is pretty pricey, but then again I am cheap... ;)

northriver_tom
07-08-2005, 07:17 PM
you know i just looked at the gregor site and that mx780 is a 17 foot boat...i wanted to see the hp rating of the boat...it was 60hp...your going with the 40...have you gone out for a ride in that boat...make sure you have enough motor..even 60 sounds small....if you have not gone for a ride go for one...dont be sorry later..

TS5655
07-08-2005, 07:43 PM
sokoo,

Have you looked in the classified at Hammer's boat? It is in the same price range as you are going to buy and set up perfectly. Sniffer members who fish with Hammer regularly will attest that it is a great boat. It's ready to go.

TS

stagger_lee
07-09-2005, 06:23 AM
For that price, a reputable dealer should'nt try to go deeper into your pocket for a prep fee! Especially one that high,its just pocket money for them! just my opinion :)

sellhomes2fish
07-09-2005, 09:27 AM
Wow, that does seem high for doc prep & freight (dealer mark-up) but not out of the ordinary. I would think about $500-700 would be more in line. Gregor is based out of Fresno, I think, so freight shouldn't be too much.

Oxbow
07-09-2005, 12:04 PM
Sokoo,

I have a 2004 15' MX570 with a 50 hp Honda and it absolutely screams. *The 40 hp would have been enough for my 15 footer but the weight of the 40 and 50 hp are identical so I went with the bigger engine. *IMO you should at least get the 50 hp if you can afford it, that extra two feet adds a whole lot more boat to push around. *Good Luck!

P.S. You are welcome to go for a ride to see what the 50 hp does for the 15 footer if you wish, just PM me.

sokoo
07-10-2005, 07:48 PM
Thanks for all the feedback. I will visit another dealer tomorrow and see what I can get from there.

Oxbow, I am very grateful that you offered me a ride in your boat, but from your user info looks like we are quite some distance away, and I am busy moving my home right now (so that I have room to park the boat trailer), so I probably won't be able to take the ride. Maybe we'll see each other on water sometime.

svtfish
07-24-2005, 02:19 PM
did you look at the North River boats.I was just there and you can buy the 17ft Revenge with motor and trailer for $13.9
Richard

Durb
07-24-2005, 03:32 PM
What size motor for that price ? Side console ? I need to get over there. 8)

svtfish
07-24-2005, 03:34 PM
it the walk thru ,40 or 50 on the back

sokoo
07-25-2005, 09:55 AM
Thanks for the info, but I have already ordered a Gregor 780. A little more expensive than that 13.9k price, and with tax, prep fee, plus a few option equip (bilge pump, trailer guides and spare tire) it cost a bit over 17k. I feel it's not a great deal, but comparing to other boats I can buy I feel it's in the reasonable range.

I have already bought all the downriggers fishfinder and radio, will go catch some fish once it arrives!

BTW, has anyone used the plastic mounting plates for transducer? I try not to drill holes on the transome below the water line, so I am thinking about drilling a couple holes above water line and put the 18" long mounting plate on. Also, how does the clamp-on portable transducer mounts (made of aluminum) work with a 17 ft?

Durb
07-25-2005, 07:02 PM
If your ordered the boat and it is still at the factory being made have them weld on a transducer bracket on each side or at least one side. Pretty common practice with several aluminum boat manufactures. I would be very surprised if they do not do this for you or if they do not understand what you are asking for.

Good luck with the new boat. What size motor did you end up getting ?

sokoo
07-29-2005, 09:28 AM
40 HP. Dealer told me the 40 can push it to over 30 MPH. Some internet source also said that a 50 HP can push a Gregor Eagle (which is the same size, but a deep V and a few hundred pounds heavier) to 35 MPH.

I have asked them to weld the transducer mount on if not too late. Good suggestion. I was given the option when I ordered the boat but thought $50 for a little thing like that was unreasonable. When I read more about proper transducer mounting, I got more concerned about the risk that I have to re-adjust the mount after I have drilled holes on the hull, so I guess I would rather spend that money instead of experimenting on the boat with holes on the transom.

sellhomes2fish
08-01-2005, 12:40 PM
For $50 the welded bracket for the transducer is well worth it. I wish mine had the bracket. I do have the polyethylene plate fastened to the transom as you mentioned above the water line. It does not have as custom of a look but is wide enough to add several other components (currently have transducer and speed pick up).

Snowtrout
08-03-2005, 09:10 AM
sokoo,

Go with the 50. The 40 and 50 are the same engine, so get the most horses for the engine weight. Plus talk to them about freight and setup. $300-500 is more like it.

I just got a 2005 alaskan 15 (375 boat weight) with a 30 tiller. I had to put a hydrofoil on it because it was stern heavy and will be buying a different prop for altitude to get more rpm's. Before the hydrofoil, could not get on plane and speed was 13mph. With hydrofoil, 22mph (gps) at tahoe by myself.

Again if i were you, go with a 50, and get another prop for higher altitude. You will be happier in the long run.

Jan_from_Humboldt
08-04-2005, 08:17 AM
Sokoo I see you have made up your mind on an aluminum rig and I've owned one but if you haven't bought yet take a good hard look at the Triumbh boats.

I just bought the 150 CC and just love it plus it rides a little better than a tin boat as it is a bit heavier, I got my entire rig out the door with a 4 stroke 40 for $13,100.00

It's easy to keep clean and a pleasure to own.

It will do an honest 30 with me and fishing gear in it and the fuel economy is impressive at about 5.1 nm per gal. (Not running at 30 of course)

sokoo
08-04-2005, 09:12 AM
Jan_from_Humboldt, thnks for suggestion, and that price does seem very good. I have ordered and paid for the boat which should soon be ready for delivery. I made up mind to buy this model because of several reasons: 1. I want a light boat because I will use a van to tow, the van is not rated for towing heavy loads, the lighter the boat the easier to handle on the road (I have 0 towing experience). Also I myself is small in size, go fishing often and sometimes have to go alone. 2. I have a wife and 2 kids who are afraid of wind, so I need something bigger than 15' and need more windshield than a CC. CC is actually a very good setup for fishing, but WT better for family. 3. Gregor has a good reputation, and I like the design and color.

I guess I could have got a better deal if I had spent more effort bargaining, but I hate that process, would much rather spend that effort in making some money in my investment than endless bargaining.

In regard to experience and recommendation from byron_s, is it possible that the lack of power with your 30HP is partly due to the high elevation and inefficient burning because of lower oxygen? Or maybe there is quite some difference between 30 and 40HP? I don't have much experience and I could be wrong, but from what I heard and saw, a 40 HP should have enough power to plane a light aluminum of that size quite easily. I saw similar size aluminum boat powered by a 35 HP out of Half Moon Bay. I saw a heavier (975 vs. 600 lbs) Gregor boat (super SeaHawk 17.5') equiped with a 50HP being sold by a dealer. That same dealer would try to power a 16 ft fiberglass boat with 70HP. The Gregor dealer at Clear Lake claimed that the 40HP is what he always sell with the MX780, and is what he recommends.

Durb
08-04-2005, 09:45 PM
sokoo,

Go with the 50. *The 40 and 50 are the same engine, so get the most horses for the engine weight. Plus talk to them about freight and setup. *$300-500 is more like it. * *

I just got a 2005 Alaskan 15 (375 boat weight) with a 30 tiller. *I had to put a hydrofoil on it because it was stern heavy and will be buying a different prop for altitude to get more rpm's. *Before the hydrofoil, could not get on plane and speed was 13mph. *With hydrofoil, 22mph (gps) at tahoe by myself. *

Again if i were you, go with a 50, and get another prop for higher altitude. *You will be happier in the long run. *



I am very surprised that your 15' gregor alaskan will not pop up on plane with out a hydrafoil and top out at 13mph. with a 30hp. I looked at that boat in a SC last weekend. Being a tiller makes some difference with all the weight in the back, however 13mph. :o What motor did you get? If that is the case I would be putting a side console in it. My 15 bayrunner I had with a 40 hp two stroke at 6000 feet elevation would pop up on plane in a matter of seconds. That is with the the driver in the far back of the boat. If you lean all your weight forward towards the middle of the boat is there any difference ?

Snowtrout
08-05-2005, 09:35 AM
Sokoo,
My boat had a max hp of 40 and i thought that a 30 honda would be fine for a 375lb boat. But first time out, at altitude and with weight, i quickly found that not only was the boat stern heavy(most gregors tend to sit in the water with the nose in the air and the butt in the water) but that i also wasn't generating enough rpm's to get the boat on plane (elevation). Fix #1 was the hydrofoil. Now i can get on plane. Fix #2 is another propeller pitched 2" down. In the process of that right now. Now i will have a prop for 0-4000' and one for +4000'.

Most will say to get at least 80% of max hp. I did 75% because the 40hp would have made it a rocket. If you get the 40, you would be at 66%. Plus, why not add the extra 10hp with no aditional weight?? Remember the 40 and 50 are the same engine and your boat weights about 600lbs unloaded. I live right by the gregor factory and have talked to them quite a few times. They said the 30hp would be great with mine and the 40hp for the mx580. Call them and talk to woody, he will let you know what works best.

The 17' is an awesome choice. If you mount downriggers, make sure to use a peice of metal or 3/4" plywood to reinforce the sidewall.

Durb,
Yes 13 mph was disturbing but it was because it would not plane. Partner moved to the front and voila, 3mph more and boat on plane. Weight in the back and wrong prop was the problem. Now it works much better. Remember that your engine was a 2 stroke, much lighter than the 185lb 4-stroke tiller i have. Also, didn't want a console on a 15' boat. You lose too much space and with 3 adults, would become a knee knocking adventure (how the boat is set up with the seat bases).
If you are looking at that boat, all i can say as that its great. Plenty of space to move around for 3 adults and solid in choppy sea's (wakeboard boats). Plus the large livewell and rod holders are real useful.

sokoo
08-05-2005, 10:15 AM
byron_s, thanks for the reminder, I will have downriggers and I do plan to back it with some wood. I think the wood would also be a good anchoring material for my wires so that I don't have to drill more holes on the boat.

I guess what I should do when the boat comes in is to ask the dealer test it with me, then I will see how well the 40HP performs. If it's good enough I will go with it because it will save me at least $500 for the price, and a little more on gas in the future. If not I can ask him to change it to a 50HP. I weigh not a lot more than 100 lbs, my fishing friends aren't big either, so some weight is saved there ;)

Jan_from_Humboldt
08-05-2005, 08:38 PM
Not a thing wrong with the aluminum boats, my last one was a 1982 vintage Western 14 footer and it served me well. Good luck with your new toy.(Grin)

Give it lots of love and attention and it will never let you down.

sokoo
09-23-2005, 08:46 AM
So I finally got the Gregor MX780 with Honda 40 HP. Tested in the bay, it seemed to have plenty of power. They hooked the gear wrong so what should be a reverse throttle now became a forward throttle (man! it was embarrassing hitting the dock twice because of this mistake!). The reverse throttle only gave me about 4200 rpm but still pushed me to a plane and a speed at about 27 mph, with 2 people and extra battery, etc. Forward throttle is supposed to give me 5500 rpm so I expect the speed in the 30s after they correct this gear problem. Also, I could keep a trolling speed of about 2 knots, which seems slow enough to work my Rebel for salmon. Motor runs so quiet we didnot need to raise our voice.

Conclusions:
1. 40HP is enough for me.
2. The fishsniffer forum is a great place to get help.
3. A forward throttle could push you backwards ???

Snowtrout
09-23-2005, 11:09 AM
glad you are happy with the setup. Just have to put in the time to see what it can really do.

But a friendly reminder: buy a second prop for elevation. Will make a huge difference in performance.

How did the dealer make that big of a mistake?? The controls are put in at gregor and all the dealer has to do is mount the engine and hook up the wires and cables.

drstressor
09-23-2005, 11:16 AM
I must have been how the shift cable was connected at the engine. I can't imagine how they could have screwed it up at the helm end. ???

sokoo
09-23-2005, 12:32 PM
The dealer claimed that the factory hooked up wrong. I am no expert in this so I can't judge whether he is right. Either way it's being fixed at no cost, and lucky enough, what I hit was the soft dock edge and not the boat in front of me.

Thanks for the advice on higher elevation, I will keep it in mind. Right now I am thinking about using it at elevation 0 foot. In nearby lakes I will probably still use my 12' Porta-Bote.

ctsron
09-23-2005, 06:07 PM
Glad they earned the $1400.00 for dealer prep. I work for a tractor dealership and the "dealer prep" is supposed to check all of those things. I would definitely have a talk with the sales mgr., no excuse for that one. Congratulations on the new boat! i am getting the bug to replace my old tub.

sokoo
09-23-2005, 09:53 PM
No I didn't buy from the dealer who insisted the $1400 freight and prep. This one charged $800 for that, at least $600 closer to being reasonable.

MoMoney
09-24-2005, 05:20 AM
Congrats on the new boat.Im sure you will enjoy yourself and be happy with your purchase.Getting a new boat has to be one of the finer moments life has to offer.

sokoo
09-24-2005, 10:23 PM
Oh yeah. The past 10 days since I had the boat I have been busy installing fishfinder, radio and antena, second battery, downrigger, etc. Lot of fun! and saves lots of money too doing it by myself. Today I spent the whole day finishing the stereo project. Made a wood box to put the stereo and the two speakers in, ready to install under the console. It sure is one of the best moments of life.